Special Education Advocacy with Ashley Barlow

Coming to you live (actually recorded) from my kitchen!!!  And my desk.  And my bathroom.  With an episode on getting it all done!  In today’s episode, which is the second in our Parent Series, I’m giving you one quick …

Today we welcome our outstanding tutor and Coach, Marissa Rothermel, to the podcast. Riss excels at providing behavior coaching to parents, and in this episode, she and I dive into what coaching looks like, behavior, …

You know those moms that are so wise that you wish you could just sit at the counters and watch them, parent? Wisdom abounds with the first guest in …

If you don’t know Mary Van Geffen, you’re going to want to!  This was the kind of conversation that I thought about for a week after! 

Mary Van Geffen is the international parenting coach for moms of Spicy Ones. She …

We understand that this stage of your child's life can be especially challenging, and we're here to provide valuable insights and practical tips.

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In this episode, we delve into the pivotal role principals play in special education, showcasing how their leadership supercharges our IEP …

Join us in our latest podcast episode as we unravel the fascinating realm of neuropsychology and how it can be a lifeline for parents navigating IEPs …

The middle of the semester can only mean one thing. Parents are exhausted. Midterms and carpools and snack bags! Oh, my! I have been working on …

We’ve talked about evaluations and eligibility a fair amount here, but we’ve never talked about the Bell Curve (I don’t think!).  Since it’s so, so important to understanding your child’s evaluation data, I’m giving you …

Join us in this week's episode as we unpack game-changing strategies to keep your special education journey on track, stress-free, and empowering. From setting up a dedicated space to mastering communication logs, we've …

What is your WATNA and your BATNA? In today's episode well talk about a negotiation strategy, that is so simple that it is often overlooked. However, I have seen it benefit so many negotiations in incredible ways. …

In this insightful episode, we dive deep into the world of Individualized Education Plans (IEPs) and explore the vital role that accommodations and …

I believe that song lyrics can really help us through so many of life’s experiences, and this is, of course, true of our experiences in advocating for our children in special education.  I was raised on Jimmy Buffett …

Listen. Life happens. Sure, you have the best intentions to spend a few minutes every day during the two weeks leading up to your IEP meeting, preparing for the meeting, but let's face it. You don't always have time. …

🎙️ Join us on our latest podcast episode,  "Parent Collaboration to Promote Inclusion," as we explore powerful ways parents can make a difference in …

Hey, fabulous listeners! You might've done a double-take, thinking, "Wait, that's not Ashley's voice!" and you'd be right! I'm Rachel Starr, the …

👉 Are you passionate about inclusivity? 👈We’re back from our little summer break with a new episode on Inclusivity and Integration.  

Join me as we delve into the heart of the matter, exploring the crucial differences …

In this episode, we explore the core principles of inclusive education. In the context of education, inclusion refers to the practice of providing equal access to quality education within a general education setting for …

Welcome to the world of Cs at abC! Clever, isn't it? 🧩 In today's podcast episode, we're honing in on two of my favorite C words - Communication and Community. We'll be exploring how you can stay connected with your …

It's a birthday week around here… And tomorrow, our Jackman will be a TEENAGER!  This is equally terrifying and exciting!  In today’s episode, I’ll share some reflections on Jack’s pre-teen years, some lessons I’ve …

I learn something from Jack Barlow almost every day of my life. The simple wisdom that he emulates is such a blessing to our family and community. In …

In today's episode, we take a fascinating journey into the world of Phonological Awareness, a crucial skill often considered as the ability to 'play …

No, no, no!  Goodness, do we ever get tired of our children saying, “No!”  I thought it was bad with toddlers… now I have (almost) two teen-agers, and I’d love to hear “Yes” just once a week!!!! 

It's hard to be on …

Need more time in your week?

Tired of running kids to activities and therapies?

Wanna just enjoy your neighborhood pool or sit by a ball field?

Want …

You’ve heard about - and maybe even asked for - a multi-sensory, evidence-based reading program, but what does that really mean?  In this webinar …

Last week we scratched the surface on the Science of Reading. Last week I also dropped all the balls, and I had to cancel a free webinar on the Science of Reading. So, this week’s podcast is basically a deeper dive …

Science is a systematic and logical approach to discovering how the natural world works.  So, the Science of Reading is the result of a systematic …

Today we welcome Michelle Morgan, SLP and dyslexia guru, to the podcast! Michelle is walking us through a hand-writing program she designed, giving us lots of tips and information on how hand-writing supports the …

Today we welcome Rosemarie Griffin of ABA Speech, and we talk about a super hot topic: how – and why- we can incorporate neurodiversity affirming practices into our therapy, tutoring, and even play sessions with …

I know from my time on non-profit boards that Potty Training is always a popular topic amongst parents.  That’s why I couldn’t believe that it had …

Of all the educators on IG that I follow, I think I’m the biggest fangirl of Hanna at My Literacy Space.  Over the past few years, I’ve so enjoyed …

Marnie Ginsberg, Founder of Reading Simplified, is a reading difficulties detective who streamlines the science and art of reading instruction so …

What's Your IEP Meeting Personality Type?  Are you Frazzled Frances, the mom that's always running behind, completely capable of advocating more but …

Don’t stress before your annual IEP meeting. I’ve got three simple tips that will help you prepare and feel calm before your meeting! These are all things you’ve heard before - but infused with experience from hundreds …

It’s IEP Season, and that can only mean one thing.  Parents in special education are freaking out!!!!  In today’s episode, I talk about why the annual meeting is just like any other meeting, give you tips for preparing …

Chances are you’ve experienced the Unexpected, and if you’ve stuck around here in the make-lemonade place that I’ve created, you have probably embraced the Unexpected as a Gift.  Today I welcome author, blogger, and …

In today’s episode we talk with Olivier and Hilda Bernier about their documentary, Forget Me Not, and man alive, are your advocacy bones going to tremble!  The documentary features their story regarding their son’s …

What’s woodworking have to do with education?  What’s teaching have to do with mental health?  What do woodworking, teacher, mental health, and darn good people have in common?  Brent Duka, that’s what!  Today’s podcast …

Dr. Annie McLaughlin joins us today to talk about behavior supports at school.  We’ll learn what behavior analysts do, how they work in schools, and …

When you think “IEP team,” do you think “teamwork?”  The question is also preposterous!  But it doesn’t have to be.  Congress called it an IEP team and required the participation of certain individuals.  Certainly, they …

The #1 question people ask me after consultations is, “How do I become an advocate?”  Tons of parents and educators see the important work of …

Do you ever feel lonely as a parent in the disability community? Ever feel like the whole world is against you? Just me? JK- I know we all feel that …

You might call it filling your cup. I igniting the fire! Networking with people in my community, attending conferences, getting dumped on. These are all reminders of why we do our advocacy. Keeping the children that we …

The first episode I recorded with school-psych-turned-advocate, April Rehrig, has been on my Top Ten list since it launched. It makes sense then that …

Thinking inclusively is not only a mindset for today’s podcast guest; it’s his job. Tim Villegas joins me on today’s episode to talk about inclusive education. Tim founded a company called Think Inclusive, and it’s …

Every special education advocate has uttered the sentence, “I should go to law school;” and every special education attorney has considered a Masters …

This episode is a 2022 Year in Review!!!  I’ll walk you through a few trends that I saw in my own office and in the larger special education advocacy community.  I’ll also introduce you to my 2023 Free Virtual …

Today we welcome Erin Yolac, an educational advocate from sunny California!  Erin and I explore her advocacy journey through the lens of her own …

Christmas Chaos!  It’s so normal and relatable.  But wouldn’t you rather relate to people with a peaceful heart and mind?!  In today’s episode, I …

Beth Liesenfeld was an OT that provided school-based supports for years.  She observed families that got what they wanted and deserved and families …

Better Speech? Yes please! In today’s episode, I talk with Lenora Edwards, a speech and language therapist, about online speech therapy and language development. You’ll learn how language develops in children as they …

You keep the data. You report the data. You’re all about the data. But they still don’t listen! Have you ever tried to capitulate your child’s data …

In today’s episode of the podcast, I will review for common pitfalls in progress monitoring. I grabbed these pitfalls from an article, but they are definitely things that I have seen in my practice repeatedly. Of …

In today’s episode, we are going to talk about all of the ancillary information that can impact data. This information is super important to understand and to consider when evaluating data. Incoming weeks we will talk …

Conflict adverse? This episode is for you! A few weeks ago, I was sitting in an IEP meeting and used a negotiation strategy that I’d just used in parenting Jack. I realized the irony… our children TEACH us skills that …

A couple weeks ago, I was asked to speak on a Hot Topic in special education advocacy at a conference for people with ADHD. Without hesitating, I suggested that I speak about executive functioning – and not only EF – …

It seems so simple. Too simple. Unbelievably simple. Like do negotiation experts actually teach this? Do law schools professors actually harp on …

In preparing for my new job, I’ve been cleaning my office building and preparing to rent it out. It’s been a real trip down memory lane. As I’ve thought about all of my favorite attorneys and advocates, a few verbs …

A Book called “The Behavior Code?” Yes please! In today’s episode, I summarize one of my most favorite books, “The Behavior Code,” by Jessica Minahan and Nancy Rappaport, MD. Let me tell you… if you read just the first …

My dad, our beloved Kurtie, often prays, “God, give me patience, and give it to me NOW!” If you’re a parent in special education, you can relate to this, and you may have whispered, “God, give me resources, and give …

One of the things I use most often in my advocacy is the United States Department of education's policy documents. These documents can help yield …

I see this trend at IEP meetings…. Teams start discussion topics like inclusion or strategies like reading interventions, and they keep getting stuck. The real reason they’re getting stuck is because the child is …

I had my first IEP meeting of the school year last week, and when my client told me it was the first one that didn’t make her cry in years, it hit …

Do you struggle to find the right balance this time of year?  Avid pool patrons, we try to squeeze out EVERY bit of fun in the sun; but we also all …

Kayla Schadegg uses her platform at Mrs. Kansas International to advocate for people with Down syndrome. Do I have your attention?!  Yes, that’s right! I have a real live beauty queen on the podcast today, and we aren’t …

Happy 100th Episode, ABC friends!!!  If we were in a school, we’d likely be dressing as 100-year-olds, complete with walkers and bushy eyebrows!  In …

The turning of the calendar page to August is a good reminder to start working on that Back to School Communication!  Have you updated your All About …

I can’t wait to share with you Holly’s story.  Whether you’re a parent, a teacher, or already an advocate, you’ll find some way to connect with Holly …

In today’s short, sweet episode we look at 34 CFR 300.116, a regulation that teases out inclusion really nicely and gives us a LOT of help in arguing …

You know when your intuition just tells you something is right, but you have a hard time advocating? It’s like you know something is right, but you …

Have you ever wondered if you should get tutoring for your child that is on an IEP or 504 Plan?  How do you find a tutor?  How do you know if they’re …

Visual Schedules Made Easy?!  Yes please!  If anyone has ever told you that your child would benefit from visuals, this episode is for you!  Right? …

In today’s episode, I discuss 3 topics/ issues that have arisen frequently in my special education law practice and that advocates and attorneys …

If you can’t beat them, join them!  I set an alarm to record early one morning over Memorial Day weekend, but my sweet guy had other plans… Jack woke up, too!  He interrupted my first ten attempts at recording, sooooo …

You’re not going to want to miss this episode. It’s so full of great information and advocacy tips – not just for people exploring eligibility but …

Sorry. It’s May.  Graduations, Sports, Awards Ceremonies, Gardening, … You know the To Do list of Craziness that the month of May brings!  Now I’m adding to the list!  Buuuuuuuttttt – Can you think ahead to August and …

One of the negotiation strategies I use most frequently is a Demand Letter.  In today’s super quick episode I introduce you to the Demand Letter and talk a little bit about how to write them. Once you master the Demand …

Join me for this week’s podcast, a discussion with Sasha Long, BCBA, MA, the Autism Helper.  Sasha works as a Board Certified Behavior Analyst, a …

It started with an idea for a Freebie for you.  It turned into a stream of consciousness!!!  Today I share a little Behind the Scenes insight into things attorneys and advocates say often – and the reason we say them!  …

Our Birth Stories. The Missed Milestones. The Comparison Game. Finding and Maintaining Child Care. Worries about Siblings. Our Jobs as Lifeguards, Therapists, Doctors, Researchers, Teachers, and General Contractors. …

Before I outlined today’s podcast episode, I triple checked that I hadn’t done this topic before,  because it’s nearly impossible that we’re 85 episodes in, and I haven’t talked about this IEP meeting tip… The Future …

I’ve had a lot of perspective-shifting experiences in my life.  I was seriously injured as a kid and have chronic pain and PTSD as a result, my son …

I have been talking to a few friends and lots of clients about inclusion recently. I feel like this is super practical strategy helps everybody so much. I can really be a game changer at the IEP table. In today’s …

I bet you’ve gone to a billion presentations on the Parts of the IEP, but this episode approaches that from a different aspect.  Are you ready?  In today’s episode, I do indeed describe the different parts of the IEP, …

You know when you and your bestie speak the same language? That’s how it is when Traci Brewer and I get together, especially if Parent Involvement is …

“If we really want to practice compassion, we have to start by setting boundaries and holding people accountable for their behavior.” -Brene Brown, …

You’ve asked, and here’s our answer: Of course I’ll do an episode on goal writing.  In today’s episode I give you my “whole picture” assessment of a …

In today’s episode a talk about one factor that IEP teams should consider which may strengthen your advocacy for extended school year services. We …

It Doesn’t Have to Be This Hard, friends.  That’s the name of my friend, Michelle Morgan’s, new e- book about dyslexia advocacy, and it’s also a very true statement.  In today’s episode we give you a little preview of …

Ready, Set, Goals!!!  Special Education puns.  That’s how low I am willing to sink for a podcast title.  Sorry, not sorry.  In today’s episode I’m giving you the ten-minute ditty on why we have goals in special …

Big celebrations happening over here at ABCo! The Cincinnati Bengals are going to the Super Bowl, our podcast has been downloaded 25,000 times, AND we’re publishing Podcast #75!!!! To celebrate, I’m bringing you a …

I call it “relentless optimism.”  It is an attitude that serves me well in IEP meeting after IEP meeting. In today's episode I will share with you how this one simple mindset shift can make a huge difference in your …

We talk about community a lot over here at ABCo.  In this bonus episode, I chat with Angela Tyszka, advocate and speaker at this year’s SEA Conference.  Angela has worked in universities, elementary, middle, and high …

I’ve seen this a million times.  A student’s evaluation report shows average scores - maybe with a few relative weaknesses- but the student’s …

What do you want from me?!!!!  That’s what my clients sometimes want to ask of their child’s teachers.  Parents struggle with special education communication.  What do I say?  When do I communicate?  Why does the …

Stars: They’re just like us.  Special Education: It’s just like your every day life. For many reasons, advocating for a child with in special education is intimidating, but in today’s episode, I’m making a real life …

Now that we got your all organized last week, it's time to dive into your child's profile. Remember that the "I" in "IEP" is "individualized." I see so many IEPs that do not address the specific needs and strengths of …

The first step to effective advocacy is organization. You have to know a child - both objectively and subjectively- in order to develop a good plan for him or her. Parents are usually experts on subjective information - …

Today’s episode has nothing and everything to do with special education advocacy.  I’m sharing a few tips that I have learned the hard way on how to …

You’ve probably attend a zillion and one seminars about writing IEP goals.  Don’t get me wrong… I do think those are helpful.  IEP goals are very …

We’re talking gratitude on the podcast today. When I taught, I found the job to be somewhat thankless. I’ll explore why I think gratitude should play …

Sensory Integration is what makes the world go ‘round in the Barlow household.  You know that shirt from the 80’s that said, “If Mama ain’t happy, …

Go.  To.  School.  If I could give you one tip about how to advocate for your child, it would simply be to go to school.  Get involved.  Be present.  …

Respect. Aretha Franklin saying about it for a reason. It’s something we all deserve and something we all crave. But sometimes when we are trying to support a child behaviorally, we forget about respect. I see this so …

“How do you do your job?  How do I get a job doing this?”  If I had a dollar for every time I’ve been asked this question, well, as BNL would say, …

Last week I interviewed two special education advocates on Instagram live, and you learned a lot about their day-to-day lives. In today’s episode, I summarize it for you. I describe exactly what an advocate does. This …

This is one of the questions I’m asked most often when I speak to disability organizations, so I’m giving you my answer in today’s episode.  I think …

Some people are just extraordinary at their jobs!  I can’t wait for you to meet Military Mom, Special Education Advocate, and Teacher Carla Wyrsch.  …

Holy cow!  The floodgates have opened!  I think I got a new referral every day last week, and SO MANY of the cases had to do with COVID-19 learning.  …

If there was a foreign language in special education, it would be Transition to Adulthood.  When IEPs start to consider a child’s transition to …

Tina B., life coach and parent in our big, beautiful disability community, delivers life lessons through storytelling.  Today we wrap up our 3-part …

“When we believe that we are in control, it adds to the chaos.”  Oh man, friends!  You’re in for a big treat in this podcast episode, Part 2 of our …

My 1 Year Anniversary gift to you is a podcast series with Tina Beauvais, a life coach that has been “refined through the fire,” a parent like you …

Advocate.  A person who publicly supports a cause of policy.  No matter the path we took to get here, we all ended at the same point: Advocate.  Some …

Sure, you know to buy the number two pencils and notebooks that will come home almost completely unused. You bleach the mold out of the lunchbox and …

I hope you’re ready to laugh!  Today’s guests, Rob Snow and Nick Doyle are masters at improvisation, and they had me laughing before we even hit record.  Rob started a non-profit called StandUp for Downs and performs …

Did you ever wonder if teachers feel compelled to advocate for their students?  Ever wonder what kind of advocacy and teamwork they desire from and with parents?  In today’s episode I talk with Ms. Lucy from …

Want to know my favorite advocacy strategy?  It’s something you can do on the first day of school with very little effort, and it will give you SO …

In the legal field, lines are often blurred.  Attorneys are kind of famous for saying, “Well, maybe.”  And, “It depends!”  But there’s one kind of case that I always turn away.  It’s not so much the case itself… it’s …

If you have a child in special education, you have undoubtedly Received an educational evaluation. If you have received an educational evaluation, you have undoubtedly been confused, frustrated, and maybe even downright …

We are getting into the nitty-gritty with behavior in this weeks episode.  I keep a list of common behavior strategies that school can employ while …

“Advocate” is a title all of us bear, but it may be one that brings hesitancy, overwhelm, and intimidation.  Most parents and caregivers in the disability community did not set out to become advocates.  Rather, our …

The first step to effective advocacy is organization. You have to know a child - both objectively and subjectively- in order to develop a good plan for him or her. Parents are usually experts on subjective information - …

Parents often consult with me for ideas on how their child’s school can be more inclusive.  I’ve come up with a list of ideas by thinking on the …

I’m using my Oprah voice.  Please welcome HEATHER AVIS!  That’s right, Heather Avis of the Lucky Few joins me in this week’s episode.  Heather is an author, blogger, narrative shifter, and shouter of worth.

In the …

Nobody expects IEP meetings to go sideways; yet, discussions over get rhetorical and unproductive.  In today’s episode I am sharing three super practical, easy steps that will help you get discussions back on the right …

The  United States Department of Education gives us several gifts every year.  The come by way of Dear Colleague Letters and Guidance Documents.  In …

Ray Nelson Advocacy and IEP Coaching Bio

I approach advocacy and IEP coaching a little differently. Part of that is my background, which is in sales …

A Manifestation Determination Review is a nice safeguard in special education.  IDEA and state laws require IEP teams to meet when a child with a …

We met on the podcast back in September to talk about how to start off the school year with success.  Why does it feel like that was five years …

If your child is disorganized, has a hard time regulating emotions, doesn’t self-start, and can’t ride the wave of life’s ups and downs, you may want …

Special education advocacy, while often stressful and complicated, is really akin to so many experiences in other areas of life.  Somehow, though, …

Now that we’re seeing light at the end of the COVID tunnel, I thought you may be ready for an updated podcast episode on special education during the pandemic.  Today’s episode brings strategies you can use to effect …

“How can a heart understand the pain of another heart and still do nothing?” -Harshada Pathare.

I’m constantly asked by parents, “Why can’t they just …

Evaluation reports can drive parents in special education absolutely crazy! I was talking to a friend last week, and she said that she was tempted to …

The Grand Finale---  Join me today for PART THREE of our big dyslexia podcast.  Daphne Corder, our big dyslexia guru, finishes up this three-part series with the big question.  How Do We Know If They’re Doing It Right?  …

Soooo many of you reached out with compliments on last week’s podcast with Daphne Corder.  Good news…  she’s back!  In Part Two of our podcast, …

Daphne Corder prepared an incredible, thorough presentation for my January Conference on Dyslexia called How Do You Know If They’re Doing the Right Thing? It was over an hour and so, so intensive.  The only problem: we …

I learned a lot about myself when Jack was a baby.  One of the most obvious things I learned is that I’m a “why” person.  I want to know the reason for stuff.  I want to know the “why.”  We worked on coming to midline, …

You’ve probably heard me talk about All About Me Books, and you may be wondering what goes in this kind of document.  In today’s podcast episode, I walk you through All About Me Books (let’s just call them AAMBs) – why …

You’re getting the inside scoop on today’s podcast!  Tales from the trenches.  I sat down and thought about three common mistakes that people make in IEP meetings and am serving them up – with recommendations for doing …

In today's episode we talk about the thing everybody fears: conflict. We don't only talk about it, but I actually encourage conflict. Keep reading. It gets better. You see, I always say that conflict yields effective …

Meet Chrissy Baily, mom extraordinaire and graceful advocate for her adorable children, Juni and Johnnie.  Chrissy had talked with representatives at …

My divorce clients sometimes say, “I’m sorry, Ashley, but you don’t understand,” often while pushing back on some optimistic or uber-reasonable advice I’ve given.  My patent response is, “You’re right.  I’m not …

Join me on today’s podcast episode as I chat with my good friend, Diana Abril, special education attorney and parent.  Diana and I not only talk about the importance of parent advocacy but also about steps that she’s …

Do you ever wonder how the experts do it?  What if  a poli-sci major that worked as a journalist and knew how to get the bottom of things got a …

We met on the podcast at the beginning of the semester – what was that eight years ago?- to discuss Preparing for the First Semester.  It felt like a more important semester but not the beast that it actually became!  …

Communication is the name of my game!  IEP teams are just that – teams.  In order to work as a team through each year, and in some cases year after …

The second I met Kara Ryska, I knew I wanted to share her wisdom with you.  Kara is a Life Coach that specializes in helping mothers that are raising children with special needs. The mother of a child with a brain tumor …

You’ve probably heard me say, “Data drives instruction.”  Here’s a new one for you.  “Evaluation data plans specially designed instruction.”  It …

We’ve spent a lot of time talking about the mechanics of an IEP and advocacy strategies, but we haven’t spent much time talking about parents’ and other team member’s emotions.  The ability of each team member to be …

Communicate communicate, communicate!  If you’ve been around here long enough, you know how much I preach communication on IEP teams!  I really think …

Chances are you’ve read a Wrightslaw book or attended a Wrightslaw training! I’m thrilled to host Pete Wright, THE special education guru, on today’s …

Behavior is always a hot topic in special education.  If a school struggles to support a child’s behavior, the child often struggles …

“Your child has to have a teacher with a certificate that allows her to teach children with more significant needs.”  Or, “you child has ___ disability category, so you’re child belongs in ___ room.”  Ever hear that?  …

In today’s episode I welcome our favorite physical therapist, Amy Martin!  Amy was my son’s PT from the time he was about 3 months old until he was 9 …

The IEP team is supposed to collaborate to develop an effective, meaningful plan with annual goals, specially designed instruction, and uniquely …

Do you feel like your child’s IEP lacks services that would benefit your child?  Have you asked for additional services when you get to that time in …

I’m no stranger to an inclusion argument, and while they’re always tricky and emotional, they’re among my favorite kind of cases.  The law is so simple, but the discussions around Least Restrictive Environment can get …

Evaluations are a fact of life in special education. They are the gateway to the IEP. School districts are required to identify, locate, and …

In this episode I address the most commonly asked questions during the COVID-19 pandemic. In the past six months I’ve helped my own clients and have spoken with parents and staff at many disability organizations about …

Sara Platenberg has a Masters Degree in Education with a focus in Gifted and Talented and Twice Exceptional Populations. She served the public school …

IEP Meetings can be intimidating. This episode takes the stress out by bringing basic, easily laid out information on what the meetings are, who attends them, why they occur, when they occur, where they are, and how …

Episode 02 delivers five basic advocacy skills that are aimed to help parents but will be applicable to anyone supporting a child in special education. They’re skills I’ve used in advocating for my own child and in …

In today’s episode, you’ll get to know me a little more. You’ll understand how I see things as a parent, a teacher, and a self-advocate. You’ll understand my “why” and be the first to know about the roadmap for the …